Pots.

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Bluesnote

Bluesnote

Squier-Meister
Aug 7, 2011
177
Lanarkshire Scotland
I've read a lot of postings on here about changing pots. I'm a bit on the ignorant side on this one:confused:
I've changed pickups and had a Strat I once owned pre-amped, but I never touched the pots.
Could someone please explain the pro's and con's on this one.
Does changing them make a lot of difference and if so, what rating would be best for a Bullet???
Cheers Hugh.

P.S. Its Seymour Duncans I've got on the guitar if that makes any difference to what I should buy?
 
N

nomadh

Squier-Nut
Jun 11, 2010
958
SD CA
My theory is most of the people who swapped pups could have just done pots and been happy. Caps or pots might make way more diff than the pup change. Its amazing how many people do pots with the pups and only give credit to the pups.
 
cybermgk

cybermgk

Squier-Nut
Sep 18, 2011
623
Northern Il
nomadh said:
My theory is most of the people who swapped pups could have just done pots and been happy. Caps or pots might make way more diff than the pup change. Its amazing how many people do pots with the pups and only give credit to the pups.
Click to expand...

Yep. A pot and cap change can make marginal pups sound good.
 
5thumbs

5thumbs

Squier-holic
Dec 19, 2009
4,683
usa
If you are gona change use good CTS pots and PIO cap. I have used Jenson caps very happy also used Vitamin T caps very good too.
 
cybermgk

cybermgk

Squier-Nut
Sep 18, 2011
623
Northern Il
stratphobic said:
marginal pickups will still sound marginal
Click to expand...
Disagree, based off of my personal experience. Perhaps, I should say marginal SOUNDING pickups can sometimes (often for stock lower cost guitars) sound good.

All too often a guitar is built with an inferior harness and badly matched caps and pots for the pups. I've seen HB guitars with 250K pots and .047 caps that just strip all the highs off of the pups, resulting in muddy, marginal or bad sounding pups. Switch those to 500K pots and .022 caps, and suddenly muddy, bad sounding pups come alive and sound decent oreven good.

Same token, even the best pup can have its sound ruined with the wrong pot and/or cap. It's basic guitar tone circuit 101. You cut off to too much of the highs, and the best pups will sound like crap.
 
cybermgk

cybermgk

Squier-Nut
Sep 18, 2011
623
Northern Il
stratphobic said:
PIO caps are a waste of money
Click to expand...
Waste of money? Depends on your viewpoint. Marginal difference, that most people are not going to hear over a good film or even ceramic cap, yes. The quality and tolerance of the cap is most important on a guitar. Amps are a whole other ball game.
 
stratphobic

stratphobic

Squier-holic
Jan 15, 2011
4,570
Arkansas
cybermgk said:
Disagree, based off of my personal experience. Perhaps, I should say marginal SOUNDING pickups can sometimes (often for stock lower cost guitars) sound good.

All too often a guitar is built with an inferior harness and badly matched caps and pots for the pups. I've seen HB guitars with 250K pots and .047 caps that just strip all the highs off of the pups, resulting in muddy, marginal or bad sounding pups. Switch those to 500K pots and .022 caps, and suddenly muddy, bad sounding pups come alive and sound decent oreven good.

Same token, even the best pup can have its sound ruined with the wrong pot and/or cap. It's basic guitar tone circuit 101. You cut off to too much of the highs, and the best pups will sound like crap.
Click to expand...

true that if you take a pickup with the wrong value of pot and cap and put the right value in it'll sound better, but going from something like a dime size import pot to a cts pot, assuming both are the same rated value and within reasonable tollerance, will make nominal difference.

cybermgk said:
Waste of money? Depends on your viewpoint. Marginal difference, that most people are not going to hear over a good film or even ceramic cap, yes. The quality and tolerance of the cap is most important on a guitar. Amps are a whole other ball game.
Click to expand...

construction material on a guitar's capacitor makes no difference because there is no sound going through the cap.
 
cybermgk

cybermgk

Squier-Nut
Sep 18, 2011
623
Northern Il
stratphobic said:
true that if you take a pickup with the wrong value of pot and cap and put the right value in it'll sound better, but going from something like a dime size import pot to a cts pot, assuming both are the same rated value and within reasonable tollerance, will make nominal difference..
Click to expand...
IF the import pot was similar tolerance, slightly agree. Quality of construction can also limit the amount of noise induced as well. Problem with most cheaper pots is they don't have decent tolerances and can vary wildly. Sucks to think you have a 500K pot but its really a 420K pot.

stratphobic said:
construction material on a guitar's capacitor makes no difference because there is no sound going through the cap.
Click to expand...

Agree to slightly agree and slightly disagree. The cap on a guitar tone circuit is a filter. The signal goes through the cap, sort-of. The flow goes from the tone pot to the capacitor, a certain level of upper frequencies will be shunted off to ground by the cap, depending on the cap value, and the rest will be 'returned' to the 'flow' to the output. So, the type of cap can have subtle flavors on the tone. For most people, its very, very subtle. So, unless your a tone freak, or have very senstitive ears, it really doesn't matter. IMHO, cheaper, smaller caps (regardless of the type of dialectic, ceramic, pio, metal film etc.) add a grainy sound.

The important part is the cap value, and whether it fits in the cavity. You can get a nice quality cap for around a buck. Also don't worry about the voltage level of the cap. It truly has no effect on tone and performance. PUPs output is in the millivolts.
 
sfcmark

sfcmark

Squier-Nut
Apr 20, 2011
685
Georgia
While it's true that no sound goes "through" the capacitor, the cap and pot adjust the resonant frequency of the tone circuit (hence the high frequencies "rolling off" as you turn it down).

Even cheap, dime-sized pots in good condition are OK - they're just not as smooth in operation or likely to last long before they start degrading. They also may not be the preferred value (resistance rating).

The original tone control in my Bullet had no discernible effect on the tone. When I swapped out the original tiny 500k pots for full-size 250k CTS pots and a NOS low voltage "mustard" cap, the tone control became much more responsive.

Keep in mind that the signal from the pickups is very low voltage. Perhaps the most important consideration after the cap value is its rated voltage. Some of the most sought-after (pretty much unavailable) tone caps are NOS 60v ceramic discs. Don't use the 600v caps meant as coupling caps in amps. Use something rated 200v or lower - 100v is even better.

If I had better ears (and fingers) I wouldn't hesitate to try a 100v PIO cap in the quest for tone. Construction materials do make a difference in audio circuits, even if appropriate values make even more difference.
 
5thumbs

5thumbs

Squier-holic
Dec 19, 2009
4,683
usa
stratphobic said:
PIO caps are a waste of money
Click to expand...

Well ill take mine out TODAY!, thanks for telling me that. I guess ill ck. with you before i make any mods so ill get right next time. Whish i would have known this before so i could have saved some time and money!
 
Last edited:
stratphobic

stratphobic

Squier-holic
Jan 15, 2011
4,570
Arkansas
5thumbs said:


Well ill take mine out TODAY!, thanks for telling me that. I guess ill ck. with you before i make any mods so ill get right next time. Whish i would have known this before so i could have saved some time and money!
Click to expand...

you don't have to be such a douche about it
 
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