No more Chinese Classic Vibe models

Discussion in 'V.C.'s Parlor' started by DougMen, Feb 28, 2019.

  1. DougMen

    DougMen Squier-holic

    Age:
    65
    Jun 8, 2017
    Honolulu, HI
    The new Indonesian made CV models introduced at NAMM are already listed on Fender's website, but the replacements for the current Chinese made ones are not, and won't be until late spring/early summer, according to Fender customer service.
     
    BlueSquirrel likes this.
  2. SquierTap

    SquierTap Squier-holic

    Age:
    38
    Jul 14, 2018
    Nashville, Tn
    Man, there goes the neighborhood, lol... I've loved Squier for 20 years, and for the first time, I'm actually gettin a lil worried... I don't wanna spend 400 bucks on a Squier... If I wanted to spend $400, I'd buy a Fender... Dare I say it, I might've been happier when the prices were lower and they offered less models and variety... I'll take the cheaper prices and build whatever I want... Lol...
    But I suppose I'm bein an old fuddy-duddy/stick-in-the-mud, lol... If we can get real for a minute, I guess the real reason I'm upset is because our lil secret is out... People are beginning to see what we've known all along... That Squier doesn't make cheap guitars that are "okay" (or even "good") for "what they are"... Squier makes good, solid, playable and serviceable instruments that happen to be fairly priced... Or at least were... Lol... I'm not quite jumpin on the doom train yet... But they're doin away with the Vintage Modified... Fine... Just leave us the Classic Vibes and leave them as the "top-o-the-pile"... But here's an idea; If you have to raise prices on ALL the upper end Squiers, then give us a lil relief on the cheaper, Bullet/Affinity end... And if not cheaper, then certainly don't raise prices on the bottom end... That does two things; People still get to be "picky" and act like their CV is "OBVIOUSLY" better than that Bullet/Affinity! Harumphph! Lol, and it keeps Squiers cheap for us musicians on a budget, tweaker/modders, and actual students...
    C'mon, Squier... You're GOOD at figurin out how to give people a LOT of guitar for a really reasonable, fair price... That's the main reason you've got all these new fans... It's cause the old cheapskates (like ME!) carried the torch for y'all until others saw the light...
    Don't start gettin all "fancy" on us now... Lol...
     
    Tele-kitty and Taurus like this.
  3. SquierTap

    SquierTap Squier-holic

    Age:
    38
    Jul 14, 2018
    Nashville, Tn
    Boy, do I feel ya! I go to the NASHVILLE Sam Ash, and they never have any good CVs... You know what they DO got? The same damned 'burst CVC, and CV Thinline Teles that have been hangin on the wall for 3 YEARS NOW... Ya know why? Cause they're 400 bucks... Just like all these new CVs comin out... Lol... Learn a lesson, man... People don't want "Fender" from Squier... We want Squier! Lol...
     
    Tele-kitty likes this.
  4. optofonik

    optofonik Squier-holic

    The whole video is worth a watch but...

    Go to 10:16 where the Capt makes a comment that is the very dilemma that I believe faced Fender/Squier with the way their respective lineups had evolved, or devolved as they may have seen it, over the past 10 years.

    It gets better, though. At 11:05 Chappers puts the nail in the coffin.

    It was a good time and very beneficial for anyone looking for affordable quality guitars, certainly, but indifferentiation of price tiered branding simply isn't tolerated as a business model.



    On a different note does anyone know how to embed a video here so that it starts at a specific time? I'm asking for a very frustrated friend.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2019
    squierbilly likes this.
  5. IronSchef

    IronSchef Dr. Squier

    Age:
    56
    Jun 18, 2012
    Flew here on my Dragonfly
  6. jjudas

    jjudas Squier-holic

    Mar 23, 2016
    Metro New Orleans
    I stopped looking when they said Poplar bodies and Indian Laurel FBs.
     
    Tele-kitty and Taurus like this.
  7. fenderzombie

    fenderzombie Squier-Meister

    296
    Nov 24, 2014
    oregon
    So are these guitars going to be just like the Japanese guitars and go up in value and collect ability
     
  8. nicod98

    nicod98 Squier-Nut

    849
    Jul 9, 2014
    Belgium
    Prices rarely go down, but I don't see the current evolution as a bad one. So now we got one "top of the line" Squier series. The 50's and 60's tele will surely be replaced with a newer incarnation (but the older ones are getting heavier and heavier). People wanting a "better wood" or "more authentic" tele have more than enough options under the Fender range. If using poplar for instance keeps the prices reasonable, then what's the problem? These only ever were made to have the "Classic Vibe", never to be as authentic as possible.

    On prices: production costs are only part of the story. Of course Fender will try to keep these as low as possible. But marketing is what strategically puts prices on things. If Fender thinks we would pay 500 USD/EUR/GBP (or whatever) for a Squier Classic Vibe, then that is what they will ask, even if production prices get cheaper. Remember that renaming the MIM Standard to Player also made the prices rise.

    I don't want a Fender (but I have a few), but I need a good quality instrument. Without Squier, I would only have bought copies, and probably never would have gotten to the F-brand.
    Keeping Squier at the "absolute beginner entry"-level ONLY with Bullet and/or Affinity would NOT be a good thing. Therefore I'm happy with the catalogue simplification.

    I suppose they will also stop the production of the Modern Player tele in China (same factory as 50s/60s Classic Vibe). If so, the MIM Player becomes the cheapest Fender. Et voilà: there is your price gap between Fender and Squier! Also: they should have kept the experimentation on the Squier level (like the now defunct Vintage Modified). For experimentation with new pickup combinations, I guess the Contemporary Series would be a nice place to start. Speaking of which: weren't these made in China too? So if the changeover to Indonesia is a trade restriction-based decision, what will happen with them?

    Next step: give the Squier Standard a belly cut, a 12" radius, and rename it "Contemporary Series". Offer them in a few more colours and in a version with a neck humbucker (like they did in the past).

    So Fender: keep the three levels: beginner (Bullet/Affinity) / budget (Standard/Contemporary) / highest possible quality on a budget (Classic Vibe).
     
    Taurus likes this.
  9. Tommy_S

    Tommy_S Squier Talker

    I actually just got myself a CV Custom tele (used, from 2012) because I've been seeing this coming since NAMM.

    I love my VMs, but they're not Classic Vibes and they certainly won't be in the future either since they're changing the specs. And I definitely don't want to pay even more for them. A new CVC tele already costs around $550 over here (Sweden) these days.

    That said, I do hope that Squier keeps making quality stuff despite changing manufacturing country. I'm hoping for more experimentation and some oddball models.
     
    Taurus and optofonik like this.
  10. BlueSquirrel

    BlueSquirrel Squier-holic

    Dec 21, 2018
    Europe
    Sorry, I haven't realised that because shops still have some where I live. I tried one in January. Maybe I should have bought it, then...
     
    Guitarmageddon likes this.
  11. DougMen

    DougMen Squier-holic

    Age:
    65
    Jun 8, 2017
    Honolulu, HI
    Classic Vibe models have been $399 for several years now, and are still amazing guitars for that price. Any comparable quality Tele or Strat from another maker will cost just as much. The new Indonesian made CV models are $349-399, so some are LESS than the current Chinese models. And, as far as the MIM Standard vs. Player series, they only went up $50 in price, for a nicer 22 fret neck, American style two point bridge, and superior alnico pickups.
     
  12. musicalmartin

    musicalmartin Squier Talker

    90
    Jun 27, 2010
    UK
    Indonesian are pretty good now .Even my Bullet Mustang was very well made just needed a fret polish
     
    optofonik and jjudas like this.
  13. Taurus

    Taurus Squier-Nut

    Age:
    25
    656
    Sep 8, 2018
    Liverpool, United Kingdom

    This, what you said in the first paragraph I am in complete agreement with. This is why I bought my Fender MIM Standard over a top Squier (the CV was about £420 in the store, and the MIM Standard £460) so not much difference.

    The other Squier Strat I really liked (Deluxe) is out of production (and cost a bit in this store too, about £360).

    And now the VM range is being made out of production, which is a good range. It’s a shame. I am tempted to try one of these new CV70’s and maybe buy one but, I agree with you there. At my local the new CV70’s are around £330 new, if they are good guitars we don’t know yet. It certainly looks like they’re as you said, that the old CV’s and VM’s have been found out to be brilliant guitars. But there aren’t many reviews out there on the new CV70’s range. So they may be good, or bad, we don’t know enough, we’ll see. Its disappointing if they won’t be as good though

    And yeah, if can get a new Fender MIM Duo Sonic for £400 or one of those new CV 70’s for almost £350ish. I know which I’d prefer. Not hitting on the Squier here just hate the prices & how they’re discounting the VM and the old CV’s. Its disappointing too cos the VM were brilliant for the price, and great budget guitars. The CV had always been a bit more expensive in comparison (during my short time in guitars)
     
    optofonik likes this.
  14. jjudas

    jjudas Squier-holic

    Mar 23, 2016
    Metro New Orleans
    I agree. I just bought an Indonesian Bullet Mustang as well. It is nice for the money. Just needs the nut slots polished and the back of the neck sanded smooth.
     
  15. optofonik

    optofonik Squier-holic


    When I was shopping guitars to record with I found everything I needed in the VM line. The VM offsets were more vintage correct than anything Fender offered at a workingman's price, the Bigsby Cab was and remains a Squier exclusive as was, for a time, the '51. The only thing in the CV line that peaked my interest was the Pinecaster but I don't have a need for a Tele PU configuration. I'm not bashing the CV line at all, I picked up a few in the stores and I thought they were clearly as good as but not appreciably better than the VM line.

    The overall impression I developed regarding the VM/CV lines was that the VM line held the unique spot in the Fender/Squier lineup. Vintage Modified models were not only affordable but they differentiated themselves from Standard, Deluxe, CV, and Fender itself. For that reason I think the loss of the VM line is the real (first world) tragedy for fans of affordable guitars.

    The golden age of affordable gits isn't over but it's moved into the next phase where the secret's out and everyone (including Fender) knows that a quality new warranted guitar that's playable right out of the box can be had for well under $500.00.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2019
    Taurus likes this.
  16. Taurus

    Taurus Squier-Nut

    Age:
    25
    656
    Sep 8, 2018
    Liverpool, United Kingdom
    I am really considering (have been for a while) buying online a VM Strat, Jag or Mustang. The problem is I had a bad experience buying online untested before (this scares me, but that was from a private seller and this would be from a store). I’m also uneasy with the idea that I’ve never tried or had a go at a VM guitar. I know I prefer the MIM Satin neck over the glossy CV neck. I’ve heard the VM neck is also glossy, but I might be fine with that. I’d need to test it. But seems affordable and perfect really for my needs.

    But budget wise they look perfect for my needs and I could get one before they all sell out. Not sure to go for it or not. I could go to my music store, see if they have any VM’s left and try them out just to test then buy online. But I really don’t think they’re in stock at my local.
     
    optofonik likes this.
  17. optofonik

    optofonik Squier-holic

    As long as the online vendor has a good return policy you should be good (reasonable length, no restocking fees, etc.); just don't damage it while evaluating it. Modern guitars produced in the millions will never gain in value but I think the VM line will hold their value at least, certain models in particular. Waiting on the used market when you can get a new warranted one now doesn't seem like a good idea because as good as they are, lemons clearly get through the QC process.

    Now, having said all that, I do believe buying used from certain vendors can be less risky than others. Case in point being this VMJM with rosewood fingerboard...

    https://www.adorama.com/us 1112898.html?utm_medium=cpc&utm_source=adl-gbase
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2019
    Taurus likes this.
  18. Redwhiteandblues

    Redwhiteandblues Squier-Nut

    Age:
    28
    513
    Mar 28, 2018
    North idaho
    Harder to find colors and FSR stuff is probably gonna Rise in value. Mark my words!
     
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  19. optofonik

    optofonik Squier-holic

    I believe I know that Fender FSRs were usually limited to 500 which does increase their value over time (I think I read that some vendors were limited as to how many they could order per storefront); my 2015 FSR Strat is regularly going for $200+ more than I paid for it. How limited were the numbers for each Squier FSR release?
     
  20. brodg68

    brodg68 Squier Talker

    Age:
    51
    92
    Jun 11, 2017
    NC
    I won't hazard a guess on the reason why they are leaving

    I will put my indonesian bullet and my gretsch streamliner, both Indo made, up against most any factory other than the obvious high ends.
     
    optofonik likes this.
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